This is in the syllabus of my Systematic Theology course I'm taking this fall:
"...write a one to two-page, double-space paper that explains the meaning of life as you currently understand it."
Umm...Love God, people, and creation, and let God use you to bring as much heaven to earth as you can. What size font should that be?
| What's your theological worldview? | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| You scored as a Emergent/Postmodern | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| You are Emergent/Postmodern in your theology. You feel alienated from older forms of church, you don't think they connect to modern culture very well. No one knows the whole truth about God, and we have much to learn from each other, and so learning takes place in dialogue. Evangelism should take place in relationships rather than through crusades and altar-calls. People are interested in spirituality and want to ask questions, so the church should help them to do this. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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Here's a link to the podcast from the night after the Seeds of Compassion event. Rob talks about the new book him and Don Golden are going to release in October, Jesus Wants to Save Christians. I also believe he talks about the issue of women in ministry (I will update once I have a listen).
By the way, If you haven't listened, you can listen to the series of sermons by the same title on ITunes. It was series when the podcast first went up. It also is a combination with "The New Exodus," (you can download it from www.marshill.org.) which talks about the framework in which we at Mars Hill reads the Bible.
I've listened to part of it. So go check it out.
(HT: Vineyard Community Church and Off the Map)
Here's a great post on focusing on the Kingdom here and after from Dan Kimball, as relayed at the Shift conference this week.
I think this is the best thing I've read so far on not swinging the pendulum on the Kindgom (or heaven/hell) to far in either direction. Very well articulated, and I would expect nothing less from Dan.
It's a must read go check it out.
This is the question we are wrestling with today in class. Our professor is convinced that the Holy Spirit does not directly reveal Himself anymore (ending with the apostolic age); this is the argument in his book. To him, God's will and spirituality, as defined in the Bible, is all about submitting to the Bible. God's will is revealed in Scripture (2 Cor. 2:6-16 is the main text for the argument), and walking in God's will is listening and obeying to the commands in Scripture.
So what about spirituality? It obviously is a current buzz word. So far, he is arguing that in 1 Corinthians (where the word is mostly used in the New Testament), is accepting Paul's teaching as authoritative as God's commands. (1 Cor. 14:37) We're still talking through, and I'll probably update, but what is your definition? What defines a spiritual person?
This was the subject of a book we had read for one of our classes. It was about decision making and God's will. The book had great points on developing a biblical worldview, but definitely had some red flags in my mind. We discussed some of those in class. So I thought I'd pose a few questions.
What is God's will?
Is God's will already revealed and it's a matter of us making decisions that coincide with that?
Can God direct reveal himself to people through the Holy Spirit any longer? Or was just to the apostolic church?
What is the role of prayer and God's will? Is God's will something that is more mysterious? Or is it pretty clear from the beginning?
I can relay what we discussed from class later, but just wanted to get your thoughts on it.
Ok, I've been reading a few posts here and there and am fascinated with the whole "you have to have the right beliefs" thing versus the "experiential thing."
I've heard both sides, and I'm always fascinated how we like to polarize the two. Are all of our experiences shaped by what we intellectually assent to (which is what seems to be what most people think of as belief, as our western influence has told us)? I don't have the answer, but I'm curious if that's what the big deal is about having the "right beliefs."
Look, I'm not saying that we shouldn't have right beliefs, I'm just fascinated about what some think those are. My theological sphere has evolved and changed over the years, and I wonder how many times in each of those moments that I thought this is the "right" belief.
For example, I remember when I told an old friend she couldn't be called to be a pastor (which she was telling me she sensed), because I said it was impossible according to Scripture. I was so bent on that belief that I'm sure it distanced us from each other. I remember I even said, "I'll support in you in whatever you do as your friend, but I just don't believe it's God's call." I wish so many times I could take that back.
I think of the same thing in the emerging church conversation/movement/whatever. There are a lot of questions being asked, and many think it's very dangerous to the church. I think it is, in a good way. Yes, there are those who go way overboard. Yes, there are those who have been so burnt by the church that they need to find someone to vent to and all of this is a reaction to being hurt. But there are those who are truly asking good questions, who want to find a way for Jesus to be expressed in the culture they find themselves in.
This is where the experience side of me kicks in. Right now, I'm going through a process of trying to be purged of this performance paradigm of worth. That what I do determines my worth. That what certain people think of me determines my worth. I know what the Scriptures say. I know the identity God says I am part of, but experiencing that in my every day life is a different story. I find the ghosts of my pasts always hovering around. I find the echo of past failures whispering back to me, "You're not good enough, you never will be." So my question is, where does the right belief come in here. To me, the intellectual assent is never enough. In fact, if my Christian journey becomes just that, it's lifeless.
I've discovered that getting all your ducks in a row theologically can take a VERY long time, but how does that help me living the journey today? So I think that experience is a big part of our theology. If it cannot incarnate in every day life, I mean, really, what good is it?
You can label me whatever you want, but these are the thoughts that ramble through my head.
What about labels? We always try to find a label for everything. Well, you're this. You're Calvinist, you're Wesleyan. It even cracks me up to here people say, "Are you an emerging church?" Ugh...it just feels like that line of thinking ends up in very bad places all of the time.
What I am finding here at Mars Hill is that we need others to journey with us through all of this stuff. If we don't have flesh and blood people to love on us, to remind us of the goodness of God, to pick us up when things are heavy, then we will die. Our lives will be nothing extravagant. I know this is the place I have to go, to experience, to be free from this sick paradigm that has controlled (and is still controlling in part) the way I live my life.
No idea why I wrote all of this down, but just had to mentally (and soulfully) vomit this out.
After all of this, Rob began to ask, "How do we proclaim this then?"
People come to Jesus in all sorts of ways. When we start boxing it in to a certain way, we are keeping people from coming to Jesus.
So how do we proclaim this?
We need to proclaim that salvation is holistic in nature. Jesus wants to save us from anger, bitterness, selfishness, sexual sin, etc...from basically every part of our lives.
He mentioned 2 views we can approach salvation with:
1. Destination--the "in or out" or "arrived" view. Jesus seems to be much more concerned with what type of person we are becoming in his teachings, not what place we're going to after we die.
2. Journey--it's possible to be "born again" and be indifferent to the things God cares about. There are moments of "arrival" along the way in our journey. It's an ongoing way of life that we enter into continually.
Rob then goes into the term "life in the age to come." Many interpret this as that other life after we die, but interestingly the Jewish people did not talk about forever that much, and when they did, they treated it with such reverence because only God could comprehend such things. The term they used for this was olam haba, or "harmony with God." In Matthew 19:16, one asks Jesus how to get olam haba, and Jesus says, "keep the commandments."
Rob then goes on talking about the term "the renewal of all things." He's taught on this many time at Mars Hill. So I won't go too much into them. Here's some references: Matt. 19:28--Jesus, Acts 3:19-21--Peter, Col. 1:15-20--Paul. It's talking about all of creation being reclaimed here and now.
Rob says that the cross is not just about personal salvation. "If we shrink the whole gospel down to individual souls, it is NOT the true gospel. Jesus is always warning to be careful when you have discussion of who's in or out and vice versa. Ironically enough, he seems to insist that those who think they're in may be out and those who think they're out may be in.
Rob then quotes a Newsweek article about Billy Graham from August 14, 2006. They asked Billy if he believed in absolutes. This is what he said:
"I believe the love of God is absolute. He said he gave his Son for the whole world, and I think he loves everybody, regardless of what label they have."
Rob says that "we invite people to trust Jesus wherever they are on their journey." At Mars Hill we call it the theology of the "clicks." Where is the next click for you? Our salvation is continuing to be worked out as we grow closer to Jesus.
Rob then quoted Richard Rohr regarding salvation:
"My simple definition of salvation would be when one begins to live in conscious union with God. This, of course, grows and develops and Jesus makes it plain that this has to begin with our bodies, in our human lives, in our experience in this world, now and forever that Jesus is surely necessary for salvation. It is not a formula or a mere affirmation, but a change in identity."
Salvation is holistic in nature. Quite honestly if you think about it, this is life-giving to so many people. Jesus is continually saving us. The cross is much bigger than we thought. The amazing thing is, this life now becomes much more important.
Jesus is not thinking about destination, orienting your way of life around this is inviting a gospel of despair, but He is asking about the kind of person you are becoming in the here and now, and in Him there is hope for that. Jesus wants to save us TODAY, to live a certain way of life, the way of shalom.
I'm going to skip the evening session of day 1, it has more to do with preaching stuff which I can talk on later. I want to get to my favorite session of the conference, day 2 AM. Rob decided to shoot for the stars and talk about the nature of salvation, namely answering this question:
"How do you get saved?"
Before he tore into the Bible, he set up some pretext. Anytime we talk about going to "heaven," many people think of this other place that is not here after this life. This is far from the teaching of the Bible and especially of Jesus. Essentially Rob says this sets up a "gospel of despair." This life on earth has nothing to with whether you go to heaven or not, just if you say the prayer, or accept Jesus, or whatever that is. Jesus teaches about life here and now.
He opened up the session going through this and asking some very honest questions. He said "Can we just be open here today and ask some honest questions about the nature of salvation?
He makes some statements. Which Jesus? Some of the Jesus' we encounter should be rejected. He mentions Stumbling Toward Faith (which by the way if you haven't read, go read it NOW). Rob read an excerpt from the foreword on how Renee's dad raped her while reciting the Lord's Prayer.
"What about the missionary who gets a flat tire?" He asks...moving on.
He also said of all the billions of people in the world, you mean were the only ones going to heaven? Just us? Would God create that many people who were destined for a life of hell? Again, just asking questions.
He then says, "So a select few who happen to believe/confess/do a few things that they can't even agree upon, and they're the ones that are in?
Age of accountability. He mentions how many hold that babies go to heaven and people use the age of accountability (most argue 12). So he says, "What about the 13-yr. old atheist who dies in a car accident? Do you go to their funeral and say, "Well, I guess he's not going to heaven."
Before he tears into the Scriptures he asks, "How is any of this grace? And then makes a beautiful statement to think about. He goes, "It's a free gift, you can't earn it...all you have to do is..." He let it hang there for awhile. He says, "Does that make any sense? It's free, but then you have to do...
He then braces himself and warns us he's going to flip through about 40 passages (which I think he about did) about how people get "saved." He's states an opening question:
"If you only had the Bible to answer, how do we get saved, what would the answer be? He then encourages us to act like we are literally reading this text for the first time.
So here we go:
Luke 7:1-9--the Roman Centurion, Jesus says, "I have not found such great faith even in Israel." This was after the centurion displayed faith that Jesus could heal his servant by just saying the word.
Luke 18:9-14--the Pharisee and tax collector--surely most of you know the view of tax collectors in the first century, not well liked people. The Pharisee brags of his many spiritual accolades, the tax collector beats his chest and says, "Lord, have mercy on me, a sinner." Jesus says that the tax collector is the one who walks home justified before God.
Luke 23:42-43--the thief on the cross, which Rob points out are more like revolutionaries that opposed Rome. Remember me when you come into Your Kingdom. Jesus says that today he will be with him in paradise (because the kingdom is here).
So Rob says, "Is it from what you say?"
John 3:1-3--Jesus with Nicodemus. Nic acknowledges Jesus is from God. Jesus says, you cannot see the kingdom of God unless you are born again.
Luke 20:35--Jesus and the Sadducees. Jesus says, "those who are worthy of taking part in the age to come..."
So Rob asks after these two texts, "Is it something you have to be?"
Matthew 6:14-15--Jesus says that if you forgive others when they sin against you, your sins will be forgiven, but if you don't, God won't forgive your sins.
Matthew 7:21--Jesus says only those who do the will of my Father will enter the Kingdom of Heaven.
Matthew 10:22--Jesus talks about persecution, and says that those who stand firm to the end will be saved.
Luke 7:36-47--Woman who wipes Jesus' feet with perfume in the Pharisee's house. Jesus forgives her of her sins.
Luke 15:18--Prodigal Son--he returns and confesses, Father throws a party (he is found).
John 11:25--Jesus says that believing is intricately linked with living.
Acts 2:37-38--the people ask Peter what must they do to be saved. Peter says, "Repent and be baptized."
So Rob asks, "Is it something you do?"
Luke 19:1-10--story of Zaccheus--chief tax collector of Jericho says he will give half of his wealth to the poor and repay those he cheated 4 times the amount. Jesus says TODAY salvation has come to your house.
So Rob asks, "Is it saying what you're going to do?"
Matthew 9:1--men who brought a paralyzed man, v. 2--"When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the man (the paralyzed man), 'Take heart, son; your sins are forgiven.'"
Mark 2:4--Four friends tear a hole open in a guy's roof and lower their paralyzed friend down. v.5--"When Jesus saw their faith, he said to the paralyzed man, 'Son, your sins are forgiven."
1 Corinthians 7:15-16--v. 16--"How do you know, wife, whether you will save your husband? Or, how do you know husband, whether you will save your wife?"
So Rob asks, "Is it something someone else does?"
Acts 9:1-6--Saul's conversion...Jesus asks him what he's doing, Saul says, "Who are you?" Jesus then tells him who He is and tells him what he's going to next! Rob is just laughing at this considering the heading at the top of the chapter in his Bible and asking if anybody ever asked the question on how Paul got saved.
So Rob asks, "Is it by asking the right question?" or "Is it something someone says to you?"
Romans 10:14-15--"How, then, can they call on the one they have not believed in? And how can they believe in the one of whom they have not heard? And how can they hear without someone preaching to them? And how can anyone preach unless they are sent?"
So Rob asks, "Is it something somebody else tell you to say/do/trust/believe?"
I'm going to stop here, and make the statement he mentioned and continue on with the next part later this week. Rob asks,
"If you were asked the question, how does a person get saved, converted, in, redeemed, etc...and you only had the Bible to answer the question..."
Rob says, "You would have LOTS of answers."
People come to Jesus in all sorts of different ways, and Jesus forgives their sins each time.
Does this make you ask questions about the nature of salvation? I sure freakin' hope it does.
Part 2 tomorrow...
In my years in the church, I had this sense that to party was a bad thing, or if you did, you had to be tame about it. I know that is part of a dominantly white church culture, but why are we so reluctant to celebrate?
I look through the Hebrew Scriptures, God commands His people to party, not only that, but He gets serious. I'll kill you if you don't take time to do this. I still haven't been to a Jewish wedding (although I saw a re-enactment of a first century Jewish wedding years ago somewhere), but they were one-week, whole village parties. Jesus seemed to frequent weddings. His first miracle was done in the midst of a wedding.
I was at a wedding this weekend for one of my former students. This student was one of my more cherished students, one of those types of kids who "got it." It was so wonderful to see Him marry a solid follower of Jesus.
My wife and daughter were with me, and if you've never met my daughter, let's just say she is one spastic party animal. I mean she loves parties. She loves celebrating. I was watching her the dance floor at 4 and half years old showing everybody up. She would randomly go up to people to try to get them to dance with her. At first no one would pay attention, so she would wisk and whirl around the dance floor. After a while her joy was infectious. She would jump from person to person, not knowing really any of them, smile as wide as the ocean horizon, dancing the night away.
I had a chance to catch up with many people from my last church. There was a moment in the midst of the reception that I stepped back and looked at my watch, and seeing that 3 hours had already past. I think about the meaningful conversations, the celebrating, the food, the people, the dancing, the life that was there. I mean isn't this a glimpse of eternity? You know what I'm talking about? Those moments where time flies, you look at your watch and you ask, "Where did all the time go?" If eternity transcends time, maybe this a glimpse of what heaven is like. What God is like. My daughter is the embodiment of celebration. She wants to party and celebrate all of the time. And she does it with complete strangers. She wants people to join her.
So I wonder, is this attitude in our hearts? Our churches? Why don't we do this more often. Like seriously, just name any excuse to throw a party and do it. There is life there somehow.
And to top it off, I had one of those moments where a former student read to me what her speech was going to be at her baccalaureate. I remember the first event she came to...so raw and high maintenance. I never really knew that on that night as I shared my story she made a decision to be a follower of Jesus. She then told me of what's happened since, and I was in tears. You love those moments. Take a picture. They don't come often.
What a beautiful day it was.
Tags: weddings, celebration, church, theology
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